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香港球員如何升Level?

本主題由 (=^x^=) 於 2023-10-31 03:45 移動
引用:
原帖由 zeio 於 2014-8-11 07:11 發表

唔好對號入座,見人評論一針見血,就理解為放棄收皮,曲解批判

成日開口埋口話唔好妄下定論、拭目以待、放眼未來,十年前一句,十年後兩句,再十年後三篤屁

「明日復明日,明日何其多!日日待明日,萬事成蹉 ...
咁你有無高見或有建設性嘅終告給港隊? 如無? 你所講嘅就真係三篤屁
我深信他們每日所流嘅汗水同努力係唔會白費

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「終告」就真係唔想有喇

忠告至少一個,港隊本地球員身高受選材所限整體偏低,無論發揮定面對現代兩面弧打法都存在局限,所以步法上要加強以彌補不足,但係步法係乒乓球最難練嘅一環,所以希望港隊能從青訓就正視。相反,林兆恒身高體格不俗,但係接中路球會比較困難、兩面擺速冇咁靈活,在站位上會有所取舍,一般會就反手而影響到正手嘅穩定性,希望港隊能從技戰術上作針對性調整,幫助佢能夠較易進入中檯相持,發揮所長。另外,前三板無論意識、質量、同膽量整體都唔夠理想,要惡補

P.S. 補上視頻案例

18:56, 面對中路出檯球,林兆恒意識上偏反手,以致右腳未能及時退半步,此時擊球點已靠後,正手不能發力,最終失誤


[ 本帖最後由 zeio 於 2014-8-11 23:13 編輯 ]
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  • (=^x^=) +5 2014-8-11 21:59
  • KKFan +5 評論要有建樹、態度正確 2014-8-11 15:40

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冇記錯麥景皓93年既,佢唔知10年10月定11年4月至入港青.
佢入到港青係因為有成績,

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王浩軒 @ 施拉格乒乓球學院



視頻中,王浩軒向施拉格「示範」正反手擺速,來回數次後,施教練上前指點,提及重心分佈上可以改善嘅地方。此視頻在國外論壇曾兩次引起熱烈討論,迴響之大後來引來施拉格出馬在論壇上發帖回應
引用:
Schlager's initial comment from the about.com discussion where this was hashed out.

"Hello TT-friends,

First of all, it surprises me that nobody asks the important questions. Because, without an answer to that question, any comment is of little value. So:

Q: So, what is the idea behind my advice?
A: To sharpen the mind for using the body weight for all strokes more consciously.
問:我建議背後嘅出發點係為乜?
答:想強調多啲有意識用重心去擊球

Q: Why to use the bodyweight for all strokes as much as possible (and important: when necessary)?
A: To decrease the power necessary (for the stroke) from other body parts (lower-, upper arm, shoulder)
問:何解要盡量用重心去擊球(更重要嘅係當有需要時)?
答:去降低身體其他部位在擊球时所需要嘅力量(前臂、上臂、膊頭)

Q: Why shouldn′t i play only out of the arm/shoulder?
A: You have to move anyway, so it would be clever to use huge part of the energy the body needs for moving for the stroke itself. Also the less power you use out of the arm/shoulder (not enough for really strong shots anyway and power quickly decreases), the more often and more precise you can hit if you reduce the power used by the arm/shoulder.
問:點解我唔應該用手臂同膊頭去打?
答:你橫[口店]都要喐㗎喇,就不如用大部份推動身體嘅能量去用響擊球上。再者,手臂同膊頭用得越少力(大板根本唔夠力同力量下降又快),你就越準越夠氣

Q: I teach my students to stand narrow. is it good or bad?
A: The more wide they stand, the more body weight they can shift each stroke and the stronger a stroke can be played. The player who stands narrow often starts to jump instead of just making a step. And while jumping it is obviously quite difficult to alter the direction if the ball is played in the "wrong" direction. Changing the direction of a step (one leg always in contact with the floor) is possible anytime, when necessary. Also jumping is a bigger change in height, so control of point of contact with the ball is going to be more difficult. I would suggest therefore a more wide stand.
問:我教學生雙腳唔分咁開,啱唔啱?
答:企得越闊,重心轉移就越大,力度就越足。雙腳企得窄嘅不時向上跳,而唔係踏一步。當向上跳嘅時候,在來球方向「錯位」時,要改變方向就比較難。當有需要時,踏一步時要改變方向(一隻腳永遠到地)就任何時候都得。另外,向上跳會引起較大嘅高度差,對擊球點嘅拿捏會更困難。因此,我個人建議企闊啲

Q: Why else is it necessary to optimize the use of my energy for hitting the ball?
A: Because sooner or later i will have troubles to follow the speed of the game if i do not use the time for the positioning of my body with the time for hitting the ball. This is actually the biggest problem in the transition from youth/junior to the adult level of the game.
問:噉仲有咩因由需要優化我擊球時能量嘅使用?
答:因為遲早我會跟唔上球速,若果我唔善用保位嘅時間去配合擊球嘅時機。呢點係青少年進入成人階段最大嘅問題

Q: So TT is basically a search for the most efficient use of body energy for a sequence of moving and hitting a 40mm ball...
A: exactly ;)
問:噉乒乓球基本上係尋找身體能量嘅最佳用法去移動同擊球啦……
答:正是;)

Q: Don Olsen said, you are nuts. Is this true?
A: Well. I don′t know. But i usually do explain why i have an opinion. And i would be more than happy to hear his reason for calling me nuts...
問:Don Olsen(美國乒壇知名人士)話你膠喎。係真冇?
答:點講好呢。我都唔知。不過,我通常都會解釋我點解有噉嘅諗法,而我都好樂意聽吓佢話我膠背後嘅原因……

regards,

Werner"
[ 本帖最後由 zeio 於 2014-8-12 01:17 編輯 ]

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上面Youtube應該是三年前維也納, 當年王浩軒取得年希望之星冠軍,也曾與施拉格打波
今年藝康國際青少年比賽團體負於日本2003年小朋友原因為何?整體成績也不見突出, 問題出在那裏?

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金錢?佢老豆有
天份?應該也唔差
刻苦?聽聞佢練波也十分認真
體院?也是當年重點陪訓球員
成績?NO
WHY?

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引用:
原帖由 小弧飛 於 2014/8/12 01:25 發表
上面Youtube應該是三年前維也納, 當年王浩軒取得年希望之星冠軍,也曾與施拉格打波
今年藝康國際青少年比賽團體負於日本2003年小朋友原因為何?整體成績也不見突出, 問題出在那裏?
有片睇吓嘅話可以略知一二

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引用:
原帖由 himhim 於 2014/8/12 01:28 發表
金錢?佢老豆有
天份?應該也唔差
刻苦?聽聞佢練波也十分認真
體院?也是當年重點陪訓球員
成績?NO
WHY?
佢老豆唔單止有米,係有心有力,早排響英國乒乓論壇都有見佢幫王小朋友推廣

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下面段片應該係上面段片幾日後拍,留意吓下盤嘅分別

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咁啱北美乒乓論壇而家有相關討論,在剛剛完結嘅英聯邦運動會,澳洲連續四屆止步八強,大家正討論加拿大王臻同澳洲 William Henzell 邊個反手爆啲之際……

帖中澳洲前國手 William Henzell(早前響澳洲公開賽反勝黃鎮廷)在談及自己的職業生涯時,說若果於青少年期可以遇到好教練、系統訓練、同好對手,成就會完全唔同

下面係原文翻譯:

A few points. My backhand is the main reason I've been able to make the top 100 and compete well against top 10 players. I feel that it holds its own against anyone in world and almost makes up for many defects in my game. It's likely though that if my forehand, footwork and counterspinning game was stronger then I wouldn't rely on my backhand so much and it would be weaker. I'm extremely efficient at what I'm good at but if I'd had more depth in my games I would have won more of my close losses (5 or 6) against top 20 or 30 players. I did beat Ma Long in doubles but my best singles win is against Monteiro in London who was no. 39.
有幾點想講。我嘅反手,係我能夠打入世界排名頭百以及十甲球手競爭嘅一大主因。呢點我認為足以與世上任何人抗衡,幾乎彌補到我打法上嘅多處缺憾。當然,若果我嘅正手、步法、同對拉方面更強勢嘅話,我就唔會依賴反手咁多,自然會較弱。響運用自己嘅強項方面,我非常有效率,但係假若我嘅技巧更厚實嘅話,我應該可以拿下更多頭二、三十名球手。我響雙打度贏過馬龍,不過個人黎講,最佳戰績都要數倫敦打低排名三十九嘅蒙泰罗

Making top 10 is incredibly hard and I was light years from doing that. Too many weaknesses. I do think it's a fantastic effort to make top 100 as I know how many good players there are and how hard they work. I think many things went wrong in my career. I did move to Europe when I was 14 for 12 years but I wasn't in the right places, working with the right coach and training with the right players for too many of those years. It wasn't until my mid twenties that I started getting a proper handle on technique and not until my late 20s that someone taught me proper footwork!! Environment is everything. My best years were when I was in tough, regimented environments in Germany and Austria where the coaches and players all pushed each other.
打入十甲係非常艱難,我要做到仲早咗一百年,太多漏洞。我同意要打入頭百係好好嘢,亦知道出面有幾多出色球手同佢哋有幾努力。我認為自己嘅職業生涯上有太多地方走咗彎路。我十四歲移居到歐洲十二年,可惜天時、地利、人和皆缺,冇去啱地方、遇到夾得黎嘅教練、同好對手訓練嘅機會。我去到二十五歲打後先開始把握到技術要領,到廿字尾先有人教我正確嘅步法!!環境決定一切。我最好果幾年係我響德國同奧地利既刻苦又紀律嘅環境下,教練同球手間互相鞭策嘅日子。

Australians, North Americans, etc have advantages and disadvantages. We're much more likely to get the opportunity to play Olympics, World Cups, etc than equivalent players. However we're at a massive disadvantage when we go to Europe to play. Generally little support and coordination from our home country, having to live so far from home, discriminated against by clubs and much fewer opportunities. The reason I moved back to Aus in 2008 at 26 to become an office worker was lack of support and opportunity.
澳洲、北美等等……有其優亦有其弊。我哋會比同等球手有更多機會參加奧運、世界盃等……只不過,當我哋去到歐洲打,會遇到好大不利。一般係缺乏國家嘅支持同配合,又要遠離家鄉,受俱樂部歧視以及少好多機會。我零八年廿六歲回流番澳洲改行做白領嘅原因就係因為冇支持同機會

Re comparing backhands. Eugene has a better block, punch and topspin from mid distance and distance but I feel like my fast close to the table topspinning is better. So then it comes down to who can steer the game towards their strength. By the way I think PL Theriault and Eugene both live in Saarbrücken in Germany and Eugene plays top league in France.
講番反手。王臻響中遠檯嘅平擋、彈擊、同上旋都好啲,而我覺得自己嘅近檯快拉好啲。所以,最後都係睇吓邊個可以令比賽向自己有利嘅方向發展。仲有,我諗王臻同 PL Theriault 都係住響德國薩爾布魯根,而王臻仲響法國打甲級聯賽

I wrote about this in more detail in some recent blogs but I'm a data analyst doing 50+ hour weeks and play TT 2 or 3 times a weeks after work when I can barely see. Yet I've had one of my better years ever. I think I do a good job of focusing my small amount of low quality training on the most important parts and strengths of my game that are the difference whether I win or lose matches. But the biggest difference has been mental. I'm happy to win and I'm happy to lose; both are fine. I'm enjoying playing a lot more for it and my results have shown it.
我響我最近果幾個 blogs 詳細寫過,我而家係一位分析員,每個禮拜做五十幾個鐘,連眼都掰唔開,放工打兩、三次波,卻係我人生最好嘅時光。我諗,響集中低質量訓練於左右大局最重要嘅部份同自己嘅強項之上,都叫做做得唔錯,不過最大嘅分別始終都係心理。輸贏都冇所謂。我而家好享受比賽,而我嘅成績亦顯示到

[ 本帖最後由 zeio 於 2014-8-12 13:05 編輯 ]
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William Henzell 講得好 翻譯得仲好
佢既反手都好正, 對自己的評價不謙不卑;

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他國球手,在缺乏國家支持同配合下,隻身跨洋為的同是乒乓夢,因為際遇吃盡苦頭還得不到認同,枉費黃金期,連大器晚成也談不上,慨嘆過後,一樣信念依舊,堅持走下去

反觀,本地年輕選手條件相對優厚得多,卻選擇半封閉集訓,少與國外交流,缺乏歷練,汗水流得再多也白費,力氣用錯地方,天份再高也枉然

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睇完好sad,但又好認同,惑者咁講唔知合唔合適,,機會是留給有準備的人,路是靠自己行出來,機會都是要靠自己去把握,實現夢想係真是要睇自己可以去到幾盡
紅雙喜DM SP500 SIGMA2 EURO 天弓5
nittaku 玻璃鳥  omg4 pro  rastant
木結他 m1jp R7
紅羽鳥 omg4 euro R7

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引用:
原帖由 zeio 於 2014-8-11 07:11 發表

唔好對號入座,見人評論一針見血,就理解為放棄收皮,曲解批判

成日開口埋口話唔好妄下定論、拭目以待、放眼未來,十年前一句,十年後兩句,再十年後三篤屁

「明日復明日,明日何其多!日日待明日,萬事成蹉 ...
zeio兄似乎用錯明日歌, 明日歌係講D人乜都唔做或者咩都係"遲D先", 但而家乒總, 體院, 球手, 甚至家長們都做緊好多野, 並不是坐以待斃的, 出去做炮灰又有何懼, 懼係連做炮灰既勇氣都無, 佢地在努力, 拭目以待的是我們, 我地呢D寂寂無名的就是行入伊館支持佢地
軒軒練咁多都輸自有原因, 狀態, 心態, 格食格, 甚至真係唔夠打都唔出奇, 但絕不能抹煞他們的努力, 我亦相信zeio兄是愛之深, 責之切, 絕不是要青少年收皮云云, 但既然近年香港的成績在進步中, 何不給大家多一點正能量?
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  • KKFan +10 非常認同 2014-8-12 22:18

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又要再請轉兄唔好斷章取意。唔該睇睇個帖主題係乜?我嘅論點就係指出本地球隊嘅問題唔係在於轉兄所強調嘅「假以時日」,而係「為時已晚」,再以前職業球手 Henzell 嘅自白作為佐證,指出尋日做得不足嘅地方,今日就要正面對待找出問題,而唔係期待聽日盲目靠努力去保救

正能量唔係畀就得,畀多啲成績就會好,Henzell 都提到響德國同奧地利嘅日子最刻苦,但係互相鞭策球技反而大漲。李靜接手港女隊不久後寫了篇文章正正指出團隊缺乏呢種氣氛。

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引用:
原帖由 zeio 於 2014-8-12 23:00 發表
又要再請轉兄唔好斷章取意。唔該睇睇個帖主題係乜?我嘅論點就係指出本地球隊嘅問題唔係在於轉兄所強調嘅「假以時日」,而係「為時已晚」,再以前職業球手 Henzell 嘅自白作為佐證,指出尋日 ...
有幾晚? 十七, 八歲就晚? 施拉格都係32歲先成為世界冠軍, 李佼41歲殺掉日本兩個主力, 苦, 做得全職運動員邊個唔苦, 香港地出路多, 呢D係個人選擇, 正能量同刻苦訓練絕對可以共存, 教練鬧球員一定有, 但我相信球員會感受到教練係幫佢地, 齋鬧, 批評已不合時宜
辛苦zeio兄找咁多片同佐證講出青少年隊的不足和面對的問題, 可能zeio兄覺得佢地已行人止步, 但小弟相信他們可走得更遠
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  • KKFan +10 支特發放正能量 2014-8-12 23:45

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回復 35# 的帖子

轉兄既正能量及鼓勵,對年青既一代絕對係一種珍貴同少有既支持

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引用:
原帖由 KKFan 於 2014-8-12 23:36 發表
轉兄既正能量及鼓勵,對年青既一代絕對係一種珍貴同少有既支持
kkfan兄言重, 正正就是小弟無乜野可以做到, 暫時就是一句加油, 同入場支持了

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轉兄都係唔明

你攞啲奇芭來做例, 都唔諗吓人地後生根基打得實, 國家競爭少先有得大器晚成

我先前提到青年轉成年階段係關鍵, 施拉格同 Henzell 都認同

呢個時間之前你根基唔實, 可以諗定出路, 你數數人, 過去幾年有幾多人放棄全職, 過到嘅有幾多係獨當一面?

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我好欣賞 Zeio 的資料及見解,透過集思廣益相信看到的小朋友或家長可以重新定位。正力量是需要,但不要自欺欺人,看見今次藝康比賽真是令我太開眼界,究竟日本韓國是選材好,教練好,訓練方法好,還是人多所以有成績。問題一定有,但如何解決?小朋友無成績,看不到希望,未到18歲已放棄乒乓球。孔軍凱打了一年全職放放棄,孔繁傑也宣佈掛拍,最后王浩軒也停留不前,另一女將當年與王浩軒一起打希望之星取得冠軍的梁梓菁也看不出明顯進步。下一代如何?是否要像何鈞傑回國內十年八年再回來才能打出頭?

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